[UPHPU] notes from austin php users group

[Joshua Simpson]

On 12/20/06, jtaber <jtaber at johntaber.net> wrote:
>
> Just a few more comments:
> 1) if the framework is bloated - just means we need a better framework,
> not that frameworks are bad.


Certainly.  But it's not always obvious at first glance when a framework is
bad, bloated, or just plain wrong.  And you can waste a week of production
time discovering it (or longer..).

2) Rails is not that bloated - right product, just wrong language :)


Well, I have a few issues with Rails, but, in general, I agree.

3) Do it yourself is fine as a learning experience on your own - but it
> is stupid for an employer.  I think it was DIY NIH that killed Netscape.


Ummm.... no.  First, DIY isn't terrible for an employer;  in fact, it's
great.  Just doing it yourself the wrong way is stupid.  Just like
everything else, you do it wrong, you're going to pay the consequences.

And, second, c'mon.  Microsoft killed Netscape.

4) Time - a good framework shouldn't take much time, Rails doesn't (just
> learning ruby does).   VB and Delphi are great RAD examples.


 I agree, Delphi is a good example (I have issues with the VB example,
however).  I think Python is probably the greatest RAD example of them all.
You can develop nearly anything in it, and I have yet to see any language
that can be utilized (in the right way) to develop as quickly.

5) As an employer I'm more interested in growing productivity than in
> employees learning by trial and error - let them learn and write a
> framework on their own time.


 Again, if you do it the right way, your productivity will, in the end, grow
considerably.